<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
	
	xmlns:georss="http://www.georss.org/georss"
	xmlns:geo="http://www.w3.org/2003/01/geo/wgs84_pos#"
	
	>
<channel>
	<title>
	Comments on: Gillum for Governor, and Racism Everywhere	</title>
	<atom:link href="https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/</link>
	<description></description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2018 11:56:44 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>
	hourly	</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>
	1	</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>https://wordpress.org/?v=6.4.8</generator>
	<item>
		<title>
		By: Li D		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-623315</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Li D]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2018 11:56:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://gregladen.com/blog/?p=30342#comment-623315</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-623289&quot;&gt;Li D&lt;/a&gt;.

Here&#039;s the quite genius Tan setting Hanson to jazz. Only for a minute unfortunately.

https://youtu.be/vUVJRbmNJHI]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-623289">Li D</a>.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s the quite genius Tan setting Hanson to jazz. Only for a minute unfortunately.</p>
<p><a href="https://youtu.be/vUVJRbmNJHI" rel="nofollow ugc">https://youtu.be/vUVJRbmNJHI</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Li D		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-623289</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Li D]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2018 11:27:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://gregladen.com/blog/?p=30342#comment-623289</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Tyvor Winns sole comment above is very good and I applaud it.
I was having a little think about polarized societies in terms of Brexit and to a lesser extent the last couple of years in USA. 
I reckon it&#039;s a bit of a misnomer. There&#039;s a certain amount of chatter, protests, academic writing, and occasional violence but even if identification with a position is widespread, heartfelt  strong identification is much less so.
Most people go about their lives.  A fair proportion likely dosnt give a shit at all and never considers the issues at hand.
So I decided to read up on Dreyfus which I knew was deeply polarizing apparently.
Wikipedia bit on Dreyfus is very readable and it&#039;s great for an hour or so if one has the time.
Here it is

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreyfus_affair

Something new to me was a seeming deathbed  confession of Zolas  chimneysweep
about 50 years later.
The whole shebang is interesting for it&#039;s fault lines and allegiances although I don&#039;t reckon Dreyfus is in the same league as Brexit in terms of family or community division.
The only remotely similar thing I&#039;ve lived through that Australians got VERY chatty about to a large degree with some polarization is the extraordinary Chamberlain case and perhaps to an extent Hanson&#039;s opening speech at her first election. ( part of which has now been put to music!!!) 
Anyhow I find Dreyfus very absorbing and there are lessons to be learned from it even today I reckon.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tyvor Winns sole comment above is very good and I applaud it.<br />
I was having a little think about polarized societies in terms of Brexit and to a lesser extent the last couple of years in USA.<br />
I reckon it&#8217;s a bit of a misnomer. There&#8217;s a certain amount of chatter, protests, academic writing, and occasional violence but even if identification with a position is widespread, heartfelt  strong identification is much less so.<br />
Most people go about their lives.  A fair proportion likely dosnt give a shit at all and never considers the issues at hand.<br />
So I decided to read up on Dreyfus which I knew was deeply polarizing apparently.<br />
Wikipedia bit on Dreyfus is very readable and it&#8217;s great for an hour or so if one has the time.<br />
Here it is</p>
<p><a href="https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreyfus_affair" rel="nofollow ugc">https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreyfus_affair</a></p>
<p>Something new to me was a seeming deathbed  confession of Zolas  chimneysweep<br />
about 50 years later.<br />
The whole shebang is interesting for it&#8217;s fault lines and allegiances although I don&#8217;t reckon Dreyfus is in the same league as Brexit in terms of family or community division.<br />
The only remotely similar thing I&#8217;ve lived through that Australians got VERY chatty about to a large degree with some polarization is the extraordinary Chamberlain case and perhaps to an extent Hanson&#8217;s opening speech at her first election. ( part of which has now been put to music!!!)<br />
Anyhow I find Dreyfus very absorbing and there are lessons to be learned from it even today I reckon.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: dean		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-621931</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dean]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2018 16:10:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://gregladen.com/blog/?p=30342#comment-621931</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[This shouldn&#039;t be a surprise but it should be made well known everywhere:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/gop-candidate-for-fla-governor-spoke-at-racially-charged-events/2018/09/09/c6d3a63c-b114-11e8-a810-4d6b627c3d5d_story.html?ICID=ref_fark&#038;noredirect=on&#038;utm_content=link&#038;utm_medium=website&#038;utm_source=fark&#038;utm_term=.1eb247973fec]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This shouldn&#8217;t be a surprise but it should be made well known everywhere:</p>
<p><a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/gop-candidate-for-fla-governor-spoke-at-racially-charged-events/2018/09/09/c6d3a63c-b114-11e8-a810-4d6b627c3d5d_story.html?ICID=ref_fark&#038;noredirect=on&#038;utm_content=link&#038;utm_medium=website&#038;utm_source=fark&#038;utm_term=.1eb247973fec" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/gop-candidate-for-fla-governor-spoke-at-racially-charged-events/2018/09/09/c6d3a63c-b114-11e8-a810-4d6b627c3d5d_story.html?ICID=ref_fark&#038;noredirect=on&#038;utm_content=link&#038;utm_medium=website&#038;utm_source=fark&#038;utm_term=.1eb247973fec</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: cosmicomics		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-618067</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[cosmicomics]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Sep 2018 14:04:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://gregladen.com/blog/?p=30342#comment-618067</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-616569&quot;&gt;BBD&lt;/a&gt;.

&quot;You can mourn the passing of a bipartisan consensus on liberal democracy without believing that we can or should return to a pre-Trump status quo. Whatever comes next will have to draw on some of the ideals of honor, decency and sacrifice celebrated on Saturday. It was ugly when America failed to live up to them, but it will be uglier still when it doesn’t even try.&quot;
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/03/opinion/columnists/trump-mccain-american-values.html

This is a powerful, thoughtful indictment of what America has become. Without romanticizing the past, Goldberg laments what has been lost.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-616569">BBD</a>.</p>
<p>&#8220;You can mourn the passing of a bipartisan consensus on liberal democracy without believing that we can or should return to a pre-Trump status quo. Whatever comes next will have to draw on some of the ideals of honor, decency and sacrifice celebrated on Saturday. It was ugly when America failed to live up to them, but it will be uglier still when it doesn’t even try.&#8221;<br />
<a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/03/opinion/columnists/trump-mccain-american-values.html" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/03/opinion/columnists/trump-mccain-american-values.html</a></p>
<p>This is a powerful, thoughtful indictment of what America has become. Without romanticizing the past, Goldberg laments what has been lost.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: cosmicomics		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617932</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[cosmicomics]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Sep 2018 09:49:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://gregladen.com/blog/?p=30342#comment-617932</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617354&quot;&gt;dean&lt;/a&gt;.

I used to teach exchange students. I tried to be supportive and, when necessary, criticized native students, who rarely showed any interest in them, and others. Obviously, you and your wife would be more affected by and sensitive to racism than I would be. And racism is a more significant historical issue in the U.S. than it is here (Denmark).

Jennifer Rubin is an example of the kind of reaction I&#039;m referring to. Before the election, her Washington Post column/blog was titled “Right Turn” and she was a mouthpiece for Republican conservatism. The title is gone and her revulsion to Trump has moved her far to the left of where she was before. 
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/opinions/wp/2018/09/02/what-could-possibly-go-wrong-when-trump-goes-to-texas/?noredirect=on&#038;utm_term=.ac686b218f2d 
Disgust and revulsion can be politically motivating factors. Visions of Trump-supporting Nazis and Ku Klux Klaners have probably changed some minds. The robocalls, coming on top of things like that, could be a nudge that changes some others. For some people, it&#039;s not one epiphanous event, but the accumulation of events that causes them to say, “Enough!” If the latest polls are indicative of a trend, more people are saying that.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617354">dean</a>.</p>
<p>I used to teach exchange students. I tried to be supportive and, when necessary, criticized native students, who rarely showed any interest in them, and others. Obviously, you and your wife would be more affected by and sensitive to racism than I would be. And racism is a more significant historical issue in the U.S. than it is here (Denmark).</p>
<p>Jennifer Rubin is an example of the kind of reaction I&#8217;m referring to. Before the election, her Washington Post column/blog was titled “Right Turn” and she was a mouthpiece for Republican conservatism. The title is gone and her revulsion to Trump has moved her far to the left of where she was before.<br />
<a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/opinions/wp/2018/09/02/what-could-possibly-go-wrong-when-trump-goes-to-texas/?noredirect=on&#038;utm_term=.ac686b218f2d" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/opinions/wp/2018/09/02/what-could-possibly-go-wrong-when-trump-goes-to-texas/?noredirect=on&#038;utm_term=.ac686b218f2d</a><br />
Disgust and revulsion can be politically motivating factors. Visions of Trump-supporting Nazis and Ku Klux Klaners have probably changed some minds. The robocalls, coming on top of things like that, could be a nudge that changes some others. For some people, it&#8217;s not one epiphanous event, but the accumulation of events that causes them to say, “Enough!” If the latest polls are indicative of a trend, more people are saying that.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Anonymous		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617676</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Sep 2018 23:03:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://gregladen.com/blog/?p=30342#comment-617676</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617354&quot;&gt;dean&lt;/a&gt;.

It is strange and a sad commentary of intelligence of the species that people from other countries coming here are subject to such treatment. Without  immigrants (and there was a time that there were no barriers to immigration) there would be no U.S.A. 

I often wonder what the Iroquois Confederacy and other native American civilizations might have evolved into if Columbus had never made the trip and the Vikings had kept their mouth shut about their being land to the west of Europe.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617354">dean</a>.</p>
<p>It is strange and a sad commentary of intelligence of the species that people from other countries coming here are subject to such treatment. Without  immigrants (and there was a time that there were no barriers to immigration) there would be no U.S.A. </p>
<p>I often wonder what the Iroquois Confederacy and other native American civilizations might have evolved into if Columbus had never made the trip and the Vikings had kept their mouth shut about their being land to the west of Europe.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: dean		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617354</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dean]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Sep 2018 01:30:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://gregladen.com/blog/?p=30342#comment-617354</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;Again, I don’t think that racism determines every vote and I don’t think all voters fall into two groups.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Fair point. I may have been a little over cynical when I posted that. Our (adult, early 20s) sons were adopted from South Korea -- been here since they were 4 months and 6 months. One works in a city near here, the other works part time and is taking some classes at a community college. They&#039;ve both been on the receiving end of more bigoted/racist BS in the last year than they ever had been before. Granted, the West Michigan area is very right wing, but it&#039;s gotten to be more common for them than it ever should be. They&#039;re handling it fairly well, but your kids are always your kids. 

&lt;blockquote&gt;“DeSantis and Scott have put out the obligatory PR messages condemning the call, so that makes it better, right?”&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I meant that as a snarky take on the condemnations. I wouldn&#039;t hazard an assessment on the likelihood that they were offered in good faith.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Again, I don’t think that racism determines every vote and I don’t think all voters fall into two groups.</p></blockquote>
<p>Fair point. I may have been a little over cynical when I posted that. Our (adult, early 20s) sons were adopted from South Korea &#8212; been here since they were 4 months and 6 months. One works in a city near here, the other works part time and is taking some classes at a community college. They&#8217;ve both been on the receiving end of more bigoted/racist BS in the last year than they ever had been before. Granted, the West Michigan area is very right wing, but it&#8217;s gotten to be more common for them than it ever should be. They&#8217;re handling it fairly well, but your kids are always your kids. </p>
<blockquote><p>“DeSantis and Scott have put out the obligatory PR messages condemning the call, so that makes it better, right?”</p></blockquote>
<p>I meant that as a snarky take on the condemnations. I wouldn&#8217;t hazard an assessment on the likelihood that they were offered in good faith.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: cosmicomics		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617316</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[cosmicomics]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Sep 2018 22:10:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://gregladen.com/blog/?p=30342#comment-617316</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617216&quot;&gt;dean&lt;/a&gt;.

&quot;People who are disgusted by racism wouldn’t support DeSantis anyway,&quot;
Perhaps not, but don&#039;t discount the possibility that there are people who aren&#039;t racists but see their ideological and economic interests represented by him. 

&quot;and people who do support him wouldn’t be bothered by the message in the calls.&quot;
Again, I don&#039;t think that racism determines every vote and I don&#039;t think all voters fall into two groups. Some of them could reject DeSantis because they refuse to be associated with this. If everyone was either a committed racist or not a racist and nothing else mattered, there would be no sense in trying to convince anyone and the polls would more or less always show the same result.

&quot;DeSantis and Scott have put out the obligatory PR messages condemning the call, so that makes it better, right?&quot;
In the sense of better than if they hadn&#039;t condemned the call, yes.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617216">dean</a>.</p>
<p>&#8220;People who are disgusted by racism wouldn’t support DeSantis anyway,&#8221;<br />
Perhaps not, but don&#8217;t discount the possibility that there are people who aren&#8217;t racists but see their ideological and economic interests represented by him. </p>
<p>&#8220;and people who do support him wouldn’t be bothered by the message in the calls.&#8221;<br />
Again, I don&#8217;t think that racism determines every vote and I don&#8217;t think all voters fall into two groups. Some of them could reject DeSantis because they refuse to be associated with this. If everyone was either a committed racist or not a racist and nothing else mattered, there would be no sense in trying to convince anyone and the polls would more or less always show the same result.</p>
<p>&#8220;DeSantis and Scott have put out the obligatory PR messages condemning the call, so that makes it better, right?&#8221;<br />
In the sense of better than if they hadn&#8217;t condemned the call, yes.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: dean		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617307</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dean]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Sep 2018 21:47:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://gregladen.com/blog/?p=30342#comment-617307</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[

Propaganda ministers everywhere would be proud to have minions like this.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Propaganda ministers everywhere would be proud to have minions like this.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: dean		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2018/08/29/gillum-for-governor-and-racism-everywhere/#comment-617216</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dean]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Sep 2018 15:29:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://gregladen.com/blog/?p=30342#comment-617216</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;This is so blatant, stupid and vulgar that it could backfire and make race an illegitimate issue. Not only that, some voters could be so alienated by this expression of support for DeSantis that they wind up voting against him. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

I wish there were a good chance of that, but it&#039;s doubtful. People who are disgusted by racism wouldn&#039;t support DeSantis anyway, and people who do support him wouldn&#039;t be bothered by the message in the calls. DeSantis and Scott have put out the obligatory PR messages condemning the call, so that makes it better, right?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>This is so blatant, stupid and vulgar that it could backfire and make race an illegitimate issue. Not only that, some voters could be so alienated by this expression of support for DeSantis that they wind up voting against him. </p></blockquote>
<p>I wish there were a good chance of that, but it&#8217;s doubtful. People who are disgusted by racism wouldn&#8217;t support DeSantis anyway, and people who do support him wouldn&#8217;t be bothered by the message in the calls. DeSantis and Scott have put out the obligatory PR messages condemning the call, so that makes it better, right?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
	</channel>
</rss>
