Comments on: Too Pretty for Homework and Allergic to Algebra https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/ Fri, 16 Sep 2011 18:51:37 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.4.8 By: Stephanie Zvan https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/#comment-11580 Fri, 16 Sep 2011 18:51:37 +0000 http://freethoughtblogs.com/xblog/?p=157#comment-11580 George, I think we’re saying the same thing more than you think we are.

I’m pointing out that the socialization of boys also contains elements that can interfere with learning. And given that societies that have become more egalitarian have focused on treating girls more like boys, while treating boys more like girls is still often taboo, I don’t think we have the data to say anything about relative underlying performance even if we assume some biological basis.

]]> By: George W. https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/#comment-11579 Fri, 16 Sep 2011 18:43:00 +0000 http://freethoughtblogs.com/xblog/?p=157#comment-11579 Steph,
I’m not claiming that you can’t have an egalitarian society without gender roles. I’m suggesting that even egalitarian societies can have gender roles that cause differences in performance through entirely social constructs.
I’m also unscientifically suggesting that if it were possible to have a society with no gender roles, and if sex biologically determines proficiency at mathematics, your evidence seems to suggest that women- stripped of gender roles- are potentially better at math.
Since Betasattva clearly accepts that “nurture” is an important factor, but that “nature” also plays a role- studies seem to suggest that as gender roles tend toward egalitarianism- women quickly close the gap in math scores. Could it not be argued, then, that in an imaginary gender neutral society women would surpass men- if we take Betasattva’s tack that “biological gender affects performance in mathematics” is the null hypothesis?
I’d also like to argue, at least anecdotally and based on a case study of one- that being male adversely affects ones ability to assess the scientific significance of internet information.
Just sayin’…..

]]> By: Greg Laden https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/#comment-11578 Fri, 16 Sep 2011 03:24:45 +0000 http://freethoughtblogs.com/xblog/?p=157#comment-11578 Hi Betasattva.

falsifying a biological basis for gender differences

Falsifying something you made up?

You’re retreated to personal attacks

Again I haven’t seen any ad hominem arguments here.

]]> By: Stephanie Zvan https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/#comment-11577 Fri, 16 Sep 2011 01:22:35 +0000 http://freethoughtblogs.com/xblog/?p=157#comment-11577

I’m declaring victory.

Of course you are. It’s ever so much easier than presenting evidence to back up your assertions.

]]> By: Greg Laden https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/#comment-11576 Fri, 16 Sep 2011 00:51:14 +0000 http://freethoughtblogs.com/xblog/?p=157#comment-11576 George! You’ve rediscovered Fisher’s Theorem but for behavior! Brilliant! That could even be real.

]]> By: Betasattva https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/#comment-11575 Thu, 15 Sep 2011 23:29:07 +0000 http://freethoughtblogs.com/xblog/?p=157#comment-11575 Hi Stephanie. None of the links you presented came anywhere close to falsifying a biological basis for gender differences in math and reading aptitude, let alone the dozens of other commonly observed gender differences. You’re retreated to personal attacks, so I’m declaring victory.

]]> By: Stephanie Zvan https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/#comment-11574 Thu, 15 Sep 2011 23:04:56 +0000 http://freethoughtblogs.com/xblog/?p=157#comment-11574 Also, from something she said elsewhere, I think Roweenie thinks you’re a “poopyhead.” Or maybe it was a “douche.” Not that they’re mutually exclusive.

]]> By: Stephanie Zvan https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/#comment-11573 Thu, 15 Sep 2011 23:03:47 +0000 http://freethoughtblogs.com/xblog/?p=157#comment-11573 Betasattva, if you have a memory problem, you could reread the thread and look at all the scientific evidence that has been presented to you.

]]> By: Betasattva https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/#comment-11572 Thu, 15 Sep 2011 23:02:26 +0000 http://freethoughtblogs.com/xblog/?p=157#comment-11572 Hi Roweenie. I get that you think I’m wrong and that there is no science to support your assertion. That about sums up this entire thread.

]]> By: Stephanie Zvan https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/09/13/too-pretty-for-homework-and-allergic-to-algebra/#comment-11571 Thu, 15 Sep 2011 22:56:38 +0000 http://freethoughtblogs.com/xblog/?p=157#comment-11571 George, there’s a difference between an egalitarian society and one that doesn’t define gender roles. It is possible to have “men’s work” and “women’s work” and still value them essentially equally. For example, it is possible to believe a woman’s voice should be calmer and quieter than a man’s but to still stop and pay attention when she speaks. So it is possible to have expectations of boys–say, that they’re more active and less attentive–that could disadvantage them in school setting, even in an egalitarian society.

Similarly, there is at least some evidence that the relative rates of diagnosis of learning disabilities that Greg talks about are a social artifact. Hard to say for sure with the research that’s been done.

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