Comments on: Creationist Teacher Fired https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/ Wed, 12 Jan 2011 21:13:50 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.4.6 By: dean https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497903 Wed, 12 Jan 2011 21:13:50 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497903 “He burned numerous students over the course of several years. Haven’t we all seem stupid science demonstrations? Isn’t this one of the great parts of growing up?
But I am sure there were more kids on the football team who got longer lasting marks every game.”

This is an incredible level of stupid. I’m sure there were more kids hurt in sports, because more participated. Some probably suffered serious injuries: nobody would deny that or dismiss it. But, those kids chose to play sports, they weren’t forced to do so.
This “teacher” injured kids not by accident, but on purpose, repeatedly, because
a) He could – he was in a position of power
b) He was forcing his religion on them

Implying that there is no difference between freshwater’s actions and accidental injuries is not reasonable.

And really, stupid science demonstrations? These weren’t stupid science demonstrations: they were designed to do one thing, non-scientific, and they did.

]]> By: KeithB https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497902 Wed, 12 Jan 2011 18:45:27 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497902 It is, but not for Freshwater. I am a firm believer in goofy, seemingly dangerous science demonstrations in classrooms! 8^)

It’s all fun until someone gets hurt!

]]> By: Warren https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497901 Wed, 12 Jan 2011 18:01:52 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497901 Greg @19, another thing to consider is that teachers are required to teach facts as facts. They are not permitted to teach delusional myths as facts.

KeithB @23, this is beginning to sound a lit like apologism.

]]> By: KeithB https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497900 Wed, 12 Jan 2011 17:53:29 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497900 He burned numerous students over the course of several years. Haven’t we all seem stupid science demonstrations? Isn’t this one of the great parts of growing up?

But I am sure there were more kids on the football team who got longer lasting marks every game.

]]> By: dean https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497899 Wed, 12 Jan 2011 14:12:18 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497899 “”Branding” is too strong a word. It left a red mark that faded in a few days.”

No. He burned two students. On one it faded, on the other it didn’t.

Besides, as mentioned by others, so the fuck what if it faded? Are you really saying that if there is no lasting mark it doesn’t matter?

]]> By: Greg Laden https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497898 Wed, 12 Jan 2011 06:40:02 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497898 Always check Panda’s Thumb for evolution news and views.

]]> By: zackoz https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497897 Wed, 12 Jan 2011 06:30:38 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497897 Let’s not forget a word of (high) praise for Richard Hoppe’s amazingly detailed and meticulous reporting of this case on Panda’s Thumb.

]]> By: Greg Laden https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497896 Wed, 12 Jan 2011 03:32:40 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497896 Fred: Now, how is a union going to stop free speech? It’s not. Unions are not all powerful universal beings. People will say what they want wether a union is there or not. I cetainly will.

That is not how it works. A teacher teaching creatinionism in a science classroom is not expressing fee speech. This has been tested in courts, it is unambiguous.

Think of the simple parallel case. Imagine I hire you to be a spokesperson for Greg Laden’s Blog. You are now my employee in this position. I instruct you to go about the blogosphere and tell people how great my blog is. Instead, you go about the blogosphere and say how crappy my blog is. I fire you. You take me to court for firing you.

What do you think happens next?

A teacher is required to teach certain things. These things are derived from standards. Meeting the standards is the basis for the school’s accreditation and in some cases funding. The standards are used to build curriculum. The teachers are hired to teach from the curriculum. If they do not they can be fired. Unions do not insist that their teachers don’t have to teach the curriculum.

]]> By: Warren https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497895 Wed, 12 Jan 2011 01:36:09 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497895 KeithB @16: Fair enough.

]]> By: KeithB https://gregladen.com/blog/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497894 Wed, 12 Jan 2011 01:31:53 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2011/01/11/post-17/#comment-497894 Warren:
I agree it was a stupid thing to do, and Freshwater stopped when told to. I just don’t want to exaggerate.

]]>