Gun violence is everyone’s story. Regardless of which story is the real one, somebody had a gun who shouldnt have, or did things with a gun that shouldn’t have happened. The victim could well have been a neighbor or a kid walking down the street.

So, no, he does not own this story, and the fact that people are mouning, unfortunately, does not require that we do not have this conversation. Had there been more conversations like this, sooner, causing more action, maybe this tragic event would have been avoided.

I did add a note to the beginning of the post saying there are different versions of the story. I had not changed it earlier because an unverified comment with no additional documentation is not on the face of it a better source than the Pioneer Press and the judicial system, though the difference is not great. I suppose.

Mike was guilty of having a loaded fire-arm while intoxicated, something he should have never done and he knows that and will pay for the rest of his life for that mistake. Jail time and probation are nothing compared to the pain of losing his best friend.

I disagree with that because it is this attitude that has kept us from making real gun ownership reform. If Mike is guilty of this (and he is innocent until proven guilty) that I really don’t care how badly he feels about it.

I have no trouble with waving a magic wand and removing all firearms. The question, of course, is what can we actually do to minimize the violence per se, with firearms obviously being a major player. One issue not here addressed is that households which have firearms are not the same as households which do not (e.g., are more likely to be biblical literalists?); they are largely self-selecting groups. How much do those average differences affect consequences from violence, drunkenness, suicide, etc.?

However, this thread should probably be allowed to die peacefully, of old age.

I must have missed where anyone has suggested a ban on private gun ownership. As far as I know that has not been suggested by anyone here. Please provide a pointer to that. It is possible that you are assuming that I am suggesting that, in which case you are providing a great example of how people come to the table in this sort of discussion thinking they know what others are thinking, then arguing against that.

Regarding the concept that there are unreported cases of people protecting themselves from home invasions with guns: Could be. One of the “nice” things about homicide and suicide is that there is always (almost) a dead body and it is impossible for authorities to ignore or underreport these events. That was the great advantage Daly and Wilson had in their study of human behavior via homicide.

However, the degree of underreporting of home invasion would have to be immense to even approach the order of magnitude of gun suicide. Impossible.

Many of my family and the people I train with are gun owners. None of them are idiots, deranged, or dysfunctional in any obvious way. Not all citizens from Alaska are Sarah Palin, and not all gun owners are trailer trash (even if they live in trailers). A couple are scientists.

Yes, true. No argument there.

A couple of (late) comments, Greg.

If Alyssa *had shot one of the intruders because she thought she was in danger, it would have been listed as a gun crime, and the surviving *intruders would have been charged. How many gun crimes are people (including police) protecting themselves by shooting somebody, and the crime charged to other criminals? And how many are avoided – like Alyssa’s story – and never make it into the gun crime statistics?

She might grow up to be a suicidal teen, true. What are the chances that she will, compared to a preteen who had been raped or otherwise seriously abused? I seem to recall that folks who have successfully minimized the damage to themselves by taking action, whatever the nature of the emergency (but especially when attacked by other people), fare much better psychologically.

You seem to be equating a blanket and complete ban on ordinary, private, gun ownership with a disappearance of firearms from the US. We tried that with alcohol once. How’d *that work out for us?

As a martial artist who doesn’t own firearms, I would like to see them all magically disappear, sure. I am annoyed at the idea that some 14 year-old gangster can shoot me dead in a random drive by. But I don’t want to see the firearms analog of alcohol during prohibition, either.

Many of my family and the people I train with are gun owners. None of them are idiots, deranged, or dysfunctional in any obvious way. Not all citizens from Alaska are Sarah Palin, and not all gun owners are trailer trash (even if they live in trailers). A couple are scientists.