Comments on: Namir Noor-Eldeen and Saeed Chmagh Killings Video

By: Ted

Ted — Fri, 23 Apr 2010 15:34:11 +0000

You guys are hilarious.

By: Martin Wright

Martin Wright — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 18:12:12 +0000

That’s me pulling the trigger? Don’t think so. I wouldn’t have missed that many times. But seriously, your argument really sucks. Were all Iraqis responsible for the invasion of Kuwait? And as much as I’d like to pick up and move to a different country, and learn a different language ever time my government does something I don’t like. It’s not really an option. Just like everyone else. Find some better emotive psycho-babble.

By: Greg Laden

Greg Laden — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 18:09:10 +0000

Alex, I’m not saying that is WAS Bush’s war, then Obama’s war and now it’s Alex’s war. I’m saying that it is our war, your’s mine, everybody’s. Those are our fellow citizens, it is our country’s policy, it is our army, any cost of this war is shared by all of us (somewhat unevenly) and the benefits are shared by all of us (somewhat unevenly).

I’m not saying it is your fault, but you know, down deep, after you suck it up and all, that is is your war.

By: Alex

Alex — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 17:58:33 +0000

Wasn’t two years ago this war called “Bush’s war”? Or “Cheney’s war”? Yes, it was, and it was termed this way to underscore that THIS WASN’T OUR WAR. What changed? The guy at the Oval Office. So, like the Orwellian sheep, we are now supposed to chant “Baaa, Bush’s war bad, Obama’s war good”, right??? This is no more my war now than it was two years ago, Greg, and I don’t care who sits in the Oval Office. Suck it up.

By: Greg Laden

Greg Laden — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 17:31:04 +0000

Alex, do you also recycle? And if so, do you consider that sufficient?

I worked for Gore. I worked for Kerry. I worked for Obama. I worked for the guy running against Bachmann (a little). I worked for my local liberal guy running for congress (lost). I worked for Franken. I worked for Franken again (recount). I’ve written about the connections between wars and personal comfort in the US in a critial way.

I feel like I’ve done one tenth of what I should be doing (and maybe a fifth of what I could be doing) and I recognize that it is my war. You don’t get to be a US citizen a nd pretend it is not your war.

It is your war, Alex. Suck it up.

By: Bill James

Bill James — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 14:59:07 +0000

At what point do we all start to wonder how many more incidents like this, and perhaps much worse...

The Mahmudiyah killings - Wikipedia

By: Bill James

Bill James — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 13:25:46 +0000

I cannot confirm this, as I have not watched the video yet. But others have reported that the pilots in the recording actually note that there are children. Is this not accurate?

When a ground team arrived after the fact, children were found in the van and they could be seen in the gun cam as as the soldiers carried them out. Comments were made.

By: Paul

Paul — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 12:34:30 +0000

Of course, I don’t even need to mention that shooting up the van which contained two children (which, to be fair, the military probably didn’t know about at the time, but that is all the more reason to be as certain as possible that you know what you are shooting at)

I cannot confirm this, as I have not watched the video yet. But others have reported that the pilots in the recording actually note that there are children. Is this not accurate?

By: Stephanie Z

Stephanie Z — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 12:17:54 +0000

Hear, hear, Damian.

By: Damian

Damian — Wed, 07 Apr 2010 11:38:44 +0000

I understand that there is likely much more context involved that may shed a different light on this incident (which works both ways, by the way), and that it can reasonably be argued that the initial shooting was perhaps “understandable”, even if it was a mistake. But if you can excuse that incident, which, whether you mean to or not, has the general affect of eliciting an “oh, what a shame….oooh, dancing on ice is coming on” in a great many people, then that same excuse can be used in almost all cases, no matter how many innocent people are and have been killed in very similar circumstances. Unless there are real standards that we can all understand and generally agree with, any incident can be excused, no matter how blatant.

The government and the military have become expert at covering these kinds of incidents up, and war has become so desensitized, secretive, and normalized in the minds of a lot of people, that even the most obvious and egregious examples of malpractice are amenable to being “managed” and then eventually forgotten, as if nothing had ever happened. But those innocent people are still dead.

At what point do we all start to wonder how many more incidents like this, and perhaps much worse, have been dishonestly and dishonorably kept secret? Do we even care, anymore? I’m uncomfortable with the idea of killing even people who wish to kill others (which is why I don’t support the death penalty), but what worries me is that we are all being conditioned to excuse wrong doing, bad behavior, and in some instances, cold blooded murder of entirely innocent people, under the guise of “war is hell”, and “support the troops”, and for fear of disrespecting people who admittedly have a very hard and stressful job.

But that isn’t a reason for me to ignore the deaths of innocent human beings, because that could have been my own mother (not that it should matter, but it does). It’s difficult, I admit, but that is all the more reason to be outraged at the fact that we are being systematically lied to. Without knowing what is real, we have no choice but to react on insufficient evidence. The only other alternative is to continue to believe what demonstrably dishonest people are telling us, all in the name of “patriotism”.