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	<title>
	Comments on: History of the Unix Operating System	</title>
	<atom:link href="https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/</link>
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	<item>
		<title>
		By: Ian Tindale		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545169</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ian Tindale]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Oct 2009 18:41:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545169</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[ Greg Laden, - but I&#039;ve never used &quot;Windows&quot;.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> Greg Laden, &#8211; but I&#8217;ve never used &#8220;Windows&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>
		By: QrazyQat		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545168</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[QrazyQat]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 14:23:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545168</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I just turned off Flash in my browser -- again -- because when I tried to open my usual blog tabs this morning Flash froze up the whole kit and kaboodle -- again.  Exiting and restarting IE with Flash enabled it did it again, just as it has so many times.  Turned it off, exited and restarted IE and opened the same tabs and zing! there they are, ready to immediately start scrolling and reading.

Yeah, Flash is fine.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just turned off Flash in my browser &#8212; again &#8212; because when I tried to open my usual blog tabs this morning Flash froze up the whole kit and kaboodle &#8212; again.  Exiting and restarting IE with Flash enabled it did it again, just as it has so many times.  Turned it off, exited and restarted IE and opened the same tabs and zing! there they are, ready to immediately start scrolling and reading.</p>
<p>Yeah, Flash is fine.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Spiv		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545167</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Spiv]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 11:53:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545167</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Flash is not fine. Flash is part of the problem. I can watch a 720p movie on my netbook smooth as silk, but an &quot;HD&quot; you-tube video running through flash is a slideshow. Every video based website in the world seems to think you have to run videos through flash, and flash does not make use of native decoding systems. It makes hardware decoding completely pointless. This is a huge and horrible thing for a world that is aiming squarely at a video based internet (while still trying to provide affordable portable computers and low power draw).

Unix/Linux: I cut my teeth working on SGI/Irix based machines &#039;way back when.&#039; Moved on to Solaris when SUN had more floating point than anyone else could touch. I still have a warm fuzzy for straight DOS though, but certainly its use is limited.

I think I need to redo my debian load. It&#039;s been quirky.

As for Greg being a &quot;newb,&quot; it hardly matters. This is a sort of political/opinion/anthro/anything-goes blog, most of the people here probably don&#039;t have a lot of exposure. The rest of us, well, I actually enjoy the *nix topics, even if revel is pointing out the (often simple) windows equiv.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Flash is not fine. Flash is part of the problem. I can watch a 720p movie on my netbook smooth as silk, but an &#8220;HD&#8221; you-tube video running through flash is a slideshow. Every video based website in the world seems to think you have to run videos through flash, and flash does not make use of native decoding systems. It makes hardware decoding completely pointless. This is a huge and horrible thing for a world that is aiming squarely at a video based internet (while still trying to provide affordable portable computers and low power draw).</p>
<p>Unix/Linux: I cut my teeth working on SGI/Irix based machines &#8216;way back when.&#8217; Moved on to Solaris when SUN had more floating point than anyone else could touch. I still have a warm fuzzy for straight DOS though, but certainly its use is limited.</p>
<p>I think I need to redo my debian load. It&#8217;s been quirky.</p>
<p>As for Greg being a &#8220;newb,&#8221; it hardly matters. This is a sort of political/opinion/anthro/anything-goes blog, most of the people here probably don&#8217;t have a lot of exposure. The rest of us, well, I actually enjoy the *nix topics, even if revel is pointing out the (often simple) windows equiv.</p>
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		<title>
		By: CyberLizard		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545166</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[CyberLizard]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 11:04:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545166</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve been working with Java since its 1.1 days. On the enterprise side it&#039;s made some terrific strides (prior to EJB 3.0, EJBs sucked donkey balls). I never really got into the whole applet thing, and now AJAX seems to be filling the needs that Flash and applets used to be used for. Except for video embedding or little flash games. Although, my company is talking about adopting Adobe Flex (which is based on actionscript) as the standard web interface for it&#039;s products, so I may get sucked down that hole. All in all, I prefer server-side code.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been working with Java since its 1.1 days. On the enterprise side it&#8217;s made some terrific strides (prior to EJB 3.0, EJBs sucked donkey balls). I never really got into the whole applet thing, and now AJAX seems to be filling the needs that Flash and applets used to be used for. Except for video embedding or little flash games. Although, my company is talking about adopting Adobe Flex (which is based on actionscript) as the standard web interface for it&#8217;s products, so I may get sucked down that hole. All in all, I prefer server-side code.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Phaedrus		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545165</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Phaedrus]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 10:50:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545165</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Worked in web development a while back - Java Beans were all the rage.  Hated it.  Code broke on every release of a new browser and was full of special cases.
Give me good old C code and a simple, embedded OS for reliability.  That said, working with Java EE now and really enjoying it.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Worked in web development a while back &#8211; Java Beans were all the rage.  Hated it.  Code broke on every release of a new browser and was full of special cases.<br />
Give me good old C code and a simple, embedded OS for reliability.  That said, working with Java EE now and really enjoying it.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Greg Laden		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545164</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Greg Laden]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 10:45:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545164</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I had actually missed Megan&#039;s comment until I saw Ray&#039;s.  Megan, normally I love your commentary but I want to ask you to refrain from being such a cyberbitch.  Most people who already know all about Linux and stuff read other blogs to learn new things, and the Linux experts who read this blog often make very helpful comments for the less experienced people who are trying out the best operating system in the world.  (even though it is not for everyone)

The attitude you express in this comment is very typical of the &quot;old days&quot; (more than about two years ago?) when people who wanted to get into using Linux were often scared off or driven off by postnoobule hacker talk. 

We call those the &quot;old days&quot; because it is not so much how it is done now.  Ignorance of Linux is not something to be disdained, it is something to be valued as this ignorance is a beautiful, empty vessel waiting to be filled with kernel talk and one liners.  

Perhaps you should cut back on your coffee intake for a couple of days...]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had actually missed Megan&#8217;s comment until I saw Ray&#8217;s.  Megan, normally I love your commentary but I want to ask you to refrain from being such a cyberbitch.  Most people who already know all about Linux and stuff read other blogs to learn new things, and the Linux experts who read this blog often make very helpful comments for the less experienced people who are trying out the best operating system in the world.  (even though it is not for everyone)</p>
<p>The attitude you express in this comment is very typical of the &#8220;old days&#8221; (more than about two years ago?) when people who wanted to get into using Linux were often scared off or driven off by postnoobule hacker talk. </p>
<p>We call those the &#8220;old days&#8221; because it is not so much how it is done now.  Ignorance of Linux is not something to be disdained, it is something to be valued as this ignorance is a beautiful, empty vessel waiting to be filled with kernel talk and one liners.  </p>
<p>Perhaps you should cut back on your coffee intake for a couple of days&#8230;</p>
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		<title>
		By: Ray Ingles		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545163</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ray Ingles]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 10:20:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545163</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Megan was never a NOOB at any point, of course. :-&gt;]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Megan was never a NOOB at any point, of course. :-></p>
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		<title>
		By: Greg Laden		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545162</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Greg Laden]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 08:06:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545162</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Ian: &lt;em&gt;Flash is perfectly fine.&lt;/em&gt;


HAHHAHAHAAHAH!!!

It only seems fine if you use Windows, where it is one of many software technologies that break your computer ll the time.  On my computers, it&#039;s the only thing that regularly does not work perfectly . 


&lt;em&gt;but the advantage was that I could create something in Flash and not have to worry about how it would look - it&#039;d look exactly like it looks on my machine here.&lt;/em&gt;

Which is why I don&#039;t even look at flash-only web sites. High resolution moniters + morons designing flash web sites = I can&#039;t see them.  


But seriously, I have no clue what you are saying regarding hardware.  Why does flash need to know the processor it is working on????  

]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ian: <em>Flash is perfectly fine.</em></p>
<p>HAHHAHAHAAHAH!!!</p>
<p>It only seems fine if you use Windows, where it is one of many software technologies that break your computer ll the time.  On my computers, it&#8217;s the only thing that regularly does not work perfectly . </p>
<p><em>but the advantage was that I could create something in Flash and not have to worry about how it would look &#8211; it&#8217;d look exactly like it looks on my machine here.</em></p>
<p>Which is why I don&#8217;t even look at flash-only web sites. High resolution moniters + morons designing flash web sites = I can&#8217;t see them.  </p>
<p>But seriously, I have no clue what you are saying regarding hardware.  Why does flash need to know the processor it is working on????  </p>
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		<title>
		By: Ian Tindale		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545161</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ian Tindale]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 05:52:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545161</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Flash is perfectly fine. All it is is a way of isolating platform differences so that you&#039;ve got one predictable set of behaviours for advanced artwork to be presented within. Of course, in its early days (ie, past decade or so) the way it integrated with browsers varied and demonstrated much dodginess, but the advantage was that I could create something in Flash and not have to worry about how it would look - it&#039;d look exactly like it looks on my machine here. 

The Flash download is acceptably lightweight and the actual binary format is open and accessible (though not changeable) by anyone who wants to read it. That it&#039;s binary isn&#039;t really the problem it&#039;s made out to be, unless you&#039;ve never spent time sifting through things with a hex editor and a look-up table to correlate codes with instructions (which I remember doing back in the early 90s when I was working with the TIFF format). 

But these days, Flash is waning. Most people who had learned ActionScript 2.x (which is essentially ECMAscript on a parallel with Javascript 1.5) looked at the completely different ActionScript 3, and decided not to learn it and jumped ship to become Ajax practitioners instead. This is good, because it demonstrated that the advance in libraries that we now work with has rendered many of the reasons for adopting Flash as invalid - Ajax libraries can more or less mean that things look predictable on different platforms, can move, and are not tied to a specific provider (although to be fair, Adobe&#039;s ownership of Flash was actually quite beneficial, stimulating and benevolent compared to what it might have been if it were a MS technology then). 

Now we have other ways of achieving the same sort of ends - SVGweb for example ( http://code.google.com/p/svgweb/ ) which uses open and free standards, authorable by anyone. Ironically, it still uses Flash as a fall-through technology if it can&#039;t find suitable capabilities on the browser it&#039;s working on, but at least you&#039;re now able to get a predictable output across platforms, until at least the horrible non-compliant browsers go away one day.

Flash is basically just used nowadays as a container for video (which is demoting the whole Flash platform to about 0.5% of what it can do), and even that might go away given widespread adoption of html5 browsers if they ever decide which video formats to prioritise. Then there&#039;s be no Flash at all.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Flash is perfectly fine. All it is is a way of isolating platform differences so that you&#8217;ve got one predictable set of behaviours for advanced artwork to be presented within. Of course, in its early days (ie, past decade or so) the way it integrated with browsers varied and demonstrated much dodginess, but the advantage was that I could create something in Flash and not have to worry about how it would look &#8211; it&#8217;d look exactly like it looks on my machine here. </p>
<p>The Flash download is acceptably lightweight and the actual binary format is open and accessible (though not changeable) by anyone who wants to read it. That it&#8217;s binary isn&#8217;t really the problem it&#8217;s made out to be, unless you&#8217;ve never spent time sifting through things with a hex editor and a look-up table to correlate codes with instructions (which I remember doing back in the early 90s when I was working with the TIFF format). </p>
<p>But these days, Flash is waning. Most people who had learned ActionScript 2.x (which is essentially ECMAscript on a parallel with Javascript 1.5) looked at the completely different ActionScript 3, and decided not to learn it and jumped ship to become Ajax practitioners instead. This is good, because it demonstrated that the advance in libraries that we now work with has rendered many of the reasons for adopting Flash as invalid &#8211; Ajax libraries can more or less mean that things look predictable on different platforms, can move, and are not tied to a specific provider (although to be fair, Adobe&#8217;s ownership of Flash was actually quite beneficial, stimulating and benevolent compared to what it might have been if it were a MS technology then). </p>
<p>Now we have other ways of achieving the same sort of ends &#8211; SVGweb for example ( <a href="http://code.google.com/p/svgweb/" rel="nofollow ugc">http://code.google.com/p/svgweb/</a> ) which uses open and free standards, authorable by anyone. Ironically, it still uses Flash as a fall-through technology if it can&#8217;t find suitable capabilities on the browser it&#8217;s working on, but at least you&#8217;re now able to get a predictable output across platforms, until at least the horrible non-compliant browsers go away one day.</p>
<p>Flash is basically just used nowadays as a container for video (which is demoting the whole Flash platform to about 0.5% of what it can do), and even that might go away given widespread adoption of html5 browsers if they ever decide which video formats to prioritise. Then there&#8217;s be no Flash at all.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Greg Laden		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545160</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Greg Laden]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 00:43:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/16/history-of-the-unix-operating/#comment-545160</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Phaedrus: The root of all evil is Flash.  I mean, you&#039;ve gotta worry about code that is supposed to be for running INSIDE your browser but that cares what chip your computer is using. That&#039;s like signing for a package from FedEx and the delivery person needs to know what kind of heating system you have in your house and what&#039;s in your refrigerator.  ]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phaedrus: The root of all evil is Flash.  I mean, you&#8217;ve gotta worry about code that is supposed to be for running INSIDE your browser but that cares what chip your computer is using. That&#8217;s like signing for a package from FedEx and the delivery person needs to know what kind of heating system you have in your house and what&#8217;s in your refrigerator.  </p>
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