Comments on: Atheists as other: The most disdained group in America? https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/ Sat, 12 Dec 2009 12:05:25 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.4.8 By: Greg Laden https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544287 Sat, 12 Dec 2009 12:05:25 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544287 Marc, from what I know of the researchers and other aspects of the context, I’d be very surprised if this study was skewed in any nefarious and intentional way, as you seem to be suggesting. The points you make may be valid, but your suggestion that this is a setup job of some kind is probably not founded. In any event, the study team is accessible and you can certainly email the study leader and ask about these things. Then either report back or write a blog post about it and send us the link.

]]> By: MarcDLS https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544286 Sat, 12 Dec 2009 11:59:13 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544286 I would like to no more about the test group. There are a disproportionally large number of people who would disapprove of an African-American spouse. In a large, and equally selected group, this should be on par with Caucasian-American.

Also, I find it deceptive that Homosexual and Recent Immigrant were left out of the “marriage” portion. This would force higher numbers in all other selections.

This study has the earmarks of being skewed.

]]> By: daen https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544285 Mon, 12 Oct 2009 11:08:35 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544285 What interests me is why people choose atheism. Or to put it more cogently, why people move from the default state of atheism (because no-one is born a practicing Jew or Muslim or Christian or Hindu or Buddhist, are they?) to practising a religion. Apart from an occasional flirtation with the Church of England for carol services and the like (whose religious views, as Eddie Izzard has succintly observed, can be boiled down to “cake or death?”), my upbringing has been entirely religion-free. Neither of my parents are of a religious bent (no, not even the C of E), nor are they ardent atheists. Religion just doesn’t have any claim on them, possibly apart from my stepdad liking the music of J S Bach. I was raised on a diet of home experiment kits from my mum’s Open University degree, Jacques Cousteau on the telly and a National Geographic subscription from my grandmother. My conclusion was that the universe is a wonderful place, and I saw no need for a god within it – from what I understood, it works quite well without anyone pulling the strings. It just *is*. This world view has terrified some of my (few) religious friends. All kinds of questions about morality and ethics come tumbling out. My answer is that a humanistic moral code based upon people respecting people would get my vote every time over one that is posited on appeasing an angry deity. Then we get into the debate about how humans are incapable of playing nicely with one another in the absence of the laws imposed upon us by a higher authority. My answer is usually that we don’t play nicely with one another anyway, ten commandments or no ten commandments. That’s the nature of human beings. At least a human-centric view of our own species’ behaviour, seen through the lens of evolutionary theory, gives some more meaningful explanation of individuals’ actions other than “they are evil” or “they are possessed” or “they are infidels”. I’ll stick with atheism (and science) for now, thank you, and take my chances along the way.

]]> By: Eupraxsophy https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544284 Mon, 12 Oct 2009 07:23:36 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544284 Being a former Christian I have lost a lot of Christian friends simply because I decided not to believe in any god.
Which makes me wonder as to why they were my friends in the first place. I had one such friend, a man from Uganda, who has seen what oppression is really like living in a third world country. He has seen how Muslims unrightfully treat others simply because they don’t believe in their god, and yet he now avoids me and refuses to have anything to do with me simply because I don’t believe in his god.

Is my decision to lose faith right? I think so because I no longer live a life in doubt. I feel as though I now have integrity in which William Shakespeare said; “This above all things to thy own self be true”, I am no longer living a lie that others choose to live. Integrity means to be honest with yourself as well as to others.

One day when I was volunteering at a homeless clinic’s pharmacy a patient ask me if I was a Christian, in which I told him no. I explained to him that you don’t have to have a god to be a good person, you just have to be humble, and that the destination of wisdom and the enlightenment of truth is traveled down the path of humility.

If we are to be judged by those who wrongfully judge us, let it be by the merits of our works of our kindness so that they will then rightfully judge themselves.

From the variety of life springs forth the fountain of diversity which only makes us more distinguished and less insignificant.

]]> By: dale lockwood https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544283 Tue, 29 Sep 2009 22:47:15 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544283 I’ve come to believe that distrust, intolerance and unreasoning hatred — and the concomitant anger — is a function of the fear of lost dignity. Serious homophobes are sometimes said to harbor repressed homosexual tendencies. Sexists may have problems with their sexual self-esteem. White racists, especially those of lower economic status, need someone they can consider inherently inferior in order to feel good about themselves.

Modernity presents theists with a constant existential challenge, forcing them to continually question their faith system in the face of advancements in science. It’s impossible to tune out the cognitive dissonance for adults, and they fear for their children (rightfully so, I suppose. Society is so full of temptation!). I think the lowly status of atheists indicated by these polls makes sense under the circumstances. The majority of Americans are not repressed homosexuals, they do not suffer from sexual dysfunction, nor are they white trash. But the majority IS prone to accept the existence of some deity. As their faith is buffeted daily by reality, it can make them uncomfortable to encounter, or even consider, someone who’s unafraid of the naked world.

]]> By: Atheist_Pilgrim https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544282 Mon, 14 Sep 2009 22:23:13 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544282 I was a catholic who once trained for years for the catholic priesthood. It has taken me a long time to shed the indoctrination by the catholic church, which commenced with being given a â??christianâ? name and baptism at birth, confession, communion, confirmation, etc., and continued through my formative years into early adulthood.

About 8 years ago I started working as an interstate driver. Spending more than 100 hours a week, every week, driving on the highways of Australia meant I had to do something more than just listen to music as I drove, so I started to think â?? about my life and, of course, my religion. I arrived at the point where I seriously wondered why we had to have â??faithâ?, why we had to believe in something for which there was no compelling evidence.

Over the next couple of years I finally came to the decision, ever so slowly, but ever so surely, that â??there is no godâ? – so beautifully described by Julia Sweeney in â??Letting go of Godâ?.

I am now 68 and over the past 7 years or so I have moved through becoming a non-theist, to agnostic, to â??probableâ? atheist, to being a fully fledged, convinced and active “out-there” atheist, one who proudly, willingly and frequently proclaims his atheism. I fear no shunning, or reprisals, nor have I experienced any.

I am very lucky to live in a relatively tolerant country (Australia) where our latest census (2006) showed that close to 20% of the population is atheist, agnostic, humanist, or some other â??no-religionâ? denomination, so the level of tolerance to beliefs and non-beliefs is much higher here than, say, in the US.

Atheists and other non-believers are seen, generally, for what we are, fellow citizens worthy of exactly the same level of tolerance and respect as theists or religionists or any other Aussie citizen. I do not claim to live in some fanatic-free, tolerance-rich Utopia, but compared to what I have read about the way atheists are treated in the US, I am pleased that I live “down-under” and not “up-over”.

]]> By: Stephanie Z https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544281 Sun, 13 Sep 2009 14:46:54 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544281 Lisa, if you and the study see things differently, I can think of three possibilities.

(1) The study was not well done. This is possible, but I don’t recall seeing any results to contradict it.

(2) You’re wrong. Have you talked to the people you point to about atheism specifically, or do you just assume that their tolerance of different beliefs applies as well to nonbelief? What percentage of the people you know (not just have enough in common with to have these discussions) do those “many” constitute?

(3) You live in something of a haven, and atheists elsewhere have it much worse than you do, as is reflected in the average degree of tolerance reported in the study.

This is the problem with counteracting broad data with anecdote.

]]> By: TonyC https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544280 Sun, 13 Sep 2009 14:29:48 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544280 Dr Meera

who or how you worship.

As an atheist… I do not worship!*

You may think that you are being all inclusive in your comment, but the underlying bias (that worship is necessary) indicates that you have a ways to go!

With you – it’s woo all the way down.

* I *do* worship my wife and kids, but I don’t suppose that counts!

]]> By: Lisa https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544279 Sun, 13 Sep 2009 13:43:29 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544279 I don’t think its that bad. Many people I know are only member of a religion in name. They don’t go to church, don’t practice, are a hair away from being agnostic, anyway. Though they aren’t ready to make the leap to atheism, they are barely any different and don’t really care who believes what.
I will bet there are as many people like I described in America as there are religious followers.

]]> By: Joshua Zelinsky https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544278 Fri, 11 Sep 2009 11:39:37 +0000 http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/09/08/atheists-as-other-the-most-dis/#comment-544278 Skullsike, so God loves people but will punish them for making conclusions based on the evidence in front of them? Interesting.

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