<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
	
	xmlns:georss="http://www.georss.org/georss"
	xmlns:geo="http://www.w3.org/2003/01/geo/wgs84_pos#"
	
	>
<channel>
	<title>
	Comments on: FDA: Limits on Acetaminophen	</title>
	<atom:link href="https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/</link>
	<description></description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 08:53:14 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>
	hourly	</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>
	1	</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>https://wordpress.org/?v=6.4.8</generator>
	<item>
		<title>
		By: Kate		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539035</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kate]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 08:53:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539035</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[check out our website  Needs to be updated because of a gag order but may answer some questions.
www.drug-warning.org]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>check out our website  Needs to be updated because of a gag order but may answer some questions.<br />
<a href="http://www.drug-warning.org" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.drug-warning.org</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Stephanie Z		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539034</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Stephanie Z]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 11:54:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539034</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Ellistrae, my understanding is that the FDA has decided to make no change in the prescription drugs, just change the warning labels.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ellistrae, my understanding is that the FDA has decided to make no change in the prescription drugs, just change the warning labels.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Ellistrae		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539033</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ellistrae]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 10:59:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539033</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[This whole thing concerns me.  As a patient with chronic pain issues, I take Percocet on a daily basis to manage my pain.  I am well aware of the possibility of liver toxicity, so I am very careful not to take too much and check labels on anything else that I might consider taking.  But if the FDA bans the combination medications, which would include things like Vicodin and Percocet, where does that leave those of us with a legitimate need for pain control?  Are we just supposed to use pure narcotics?  Or are we going to get totally screwed?  Believe me, I wish I could live a normal life without pain medication of any sort, and I am actively trying to find a solution to my very bizarre health problem, but I cannot function without pain relief, and aspirin is not going to cut it.  I seriously hope the FDA does not leave those of us with chronic pain out in the cold on this one.  I dare any of them to walk a day in my shoes and then tell me that I don&#039;t need anything stronger than aspirin or some other OTC medication.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This whole thing concerns me.  As a patient with chronic pain issues, I take Percocet on a daily basis to manage my pain.  I am well aware of the possibility of liver toxicity, so I am very careful not to take too much and check labels on anything else that I might consider taking.  But if the FDA bans the combination medications, which would include things like Vicodin and Percocet, where does that leave those of us with a legitimate need for pain control?  Are we just supposed to use pure narcotics?  Or are we going to get totally screwed?  Believe me, I wish I could live a normal life without pain medication of any sort, and I am actively trying to find a solution to my very bizarre health problem, but I cannot function without pain relief, and aspirin is not going to cut it.  I seriously hope the FDA does not leave those of us with chronic pain out in the cold on this one.  I dare any of them to walk a day in my shoes and then tell me that I don&#8217;t need anything stronger than aspirin or some other OTC medication.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: davidp		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539032</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[davidp]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 23:00:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539032</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Why aren&#039;t the FDA suggesting requiring methionine to be included in medicines with Acetaminophen? Methionine counteracts the glutathione depletion in the liver, which is apparently the main mechanism of liver damage due to Acetaminophen overdose.

I&#039;d have thought this would be more effective than changing the labelling on boxes, and expecting that to change people&#039;s behaviours, which seems to be main reaction the Australian drug regulator is proposing.
[I do not have any involvement in sale or manufacture of drugs] ]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why aren&#8217;t the FDA suggesting requiring methionine to be included in medicines with Acetaminophen? Methionine counteracts the glutathione depletion in the liver, which is apparently the main mechanism of liver damage due to Acetaminophen overdose.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d have thought this would be more effective than changing the labelling on boxes, and expecting that to change people&#8217;s behaviours, which seems to be main reaction the Australian drug regulator is proposing.<br />
[I do not have any involvement in sale or manufacture of drugs] </p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Barry		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539031</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Barry]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 17:04:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539031</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Anthony, I truly don&#039;t know why I bother replying. At least you appear to have read what I wrote. I&#039;ll even say that you get a few things correct!

RIGHT:
&quot;You are right that natural products have side effects and can be toxic at a certain level.&quot;

WRONG:
&quot;The thing is, usually that level is ridiculously high compared to the average prescription drug.&quot;

Again, to understand why that sentence is such a tradgedy... you&#039;re going to need to read the first few chapters of a pharmacology book. Seriously... it&#039;ll take you an hour at most. We compare the efficacy and danger of drugs based on things called &quot;effective dose&quot; and &quot;lethal dose&quot; among other terms. The ED50 is the effective dose that works for 50 percent of the subjects (usually rats). The LD50 is the lethal dose for 50 percent of the subjects. The safety of a drug is measured by a ratio (something like LD50/ED50 or LD1/ED99 something like that I don&#039;t have the time to look it up). Note that most alternative medicines don&#039;t have an &quot;effective dose&quot; because they don&#039;t have a measurable endpoint! However, all alternative medicines have a lethal dose, no bones about it. Do you understand why your quote above makes absolutely no sense? To suggest that conventional medicines have a lower safety margin than alternative medicines is absurd. You&#039;re comparing drugs that work, to drugs that don&#039;t. Not even apples and oranges. 

WRONG: &quot;As for the prescription drugs: The big problem is that they are only prescribed to treat your &#039;symptoms&#039;. &#039;Oh, your feeling sad - you must have a prozac deficiency. Take this for the next 30 years&#039; -- Great system we have here.&quot;

You&#039;ve gone off the deep end here. I&#039;m honestly contemplating if you&#039;re a Poe.

WRONG: &quot;People need to find the root cause of their illness and treat it naturally.
If you are completely happy with modern medicine -- good for you.
I was not happy with it, and have chosen to use a safer, natural approach.&quot;

What do you even mean by &quot;root cause of their illness&quot;? Do you mean spirits? Do you mean molecules? What on earth are you talking about? And what is your obsession with the word &quot;natural&quot;? You, sir, have fallen for the naturalist fallacy! For some reason, you and many other people think that because something is natural, it&#039;s good, and that if something is synthetic, it&#039;s bad. Many of the drugs we use today are natural (we just don&#039;t call them alternative or &quot;natural&quot; medicine because it&#039;s pointless). Botulism toxin is natural. So are bacteria. Leukemia is natural. The statins are NOT NATURAL. Many antibiotics are synthetically altered. The computer you&#039;re reading this on is NOT NATURAL. Again, you&#039;ve fallen for the naturalist fallacy. Classic. Your brain needs rewiring bro.

Hey you get one right!
CORRECT: &quot;As for evidence? Search PubMed - you can find a lot of good studies on natural products. Are there as many studies as there are on drugs? No - because you can&#039;t patent a natural product and make a gigantic profit (which pays for the studies).&quot;

Yep, that is an unfortunate part of our system today. Many drugs don&#039;t get studied due to lack of funding, probably because a lack of profitability. That being said... and I&#039;ve repeated this several times now. IF AN &quot;ALTERNATIVE&quot; or &quot;NATURAL&quot; drug has been shown to work on PubMed... it is no longer considered an alternative medicine, or a &quot;natural&quot; medicine... from then on, it is just medicine. Doctors use drugs that have been shown to work. We don&#039;t care whether it&#039;s natural, herbal, synthetic, alien, whatever you want to call it. We use drugs that are safe enough to where the benefits outweigh the risks. Note that if a drug has no benefits (ie alternative meds), the benefits will never outweigh the risks. 



 ]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anthony, I truly don&#8217;t know why I bother replying. At least you appear to have read what I wrote. I&#8217;ll even say that you get a few things correct!</p>
<p>RIGHT:<br />
&#8220;You are right that natural products have side effects and can be toxic at a certain level.&#8221;</p>
<p>WRONG:<br />
&#8220;The thing is, usually that level is ridiculously high compared to the average prescription drug.&#8221;</p>
<p>Again, to understand why that sentence is such a tradgedy&#8230; you&#8217;re going to need to read the first few chapters of a pharmacology book. Seriously&#8230; it&#8217;ll take you an hour at most. We compare the efficacy and danger of drugs based on things called &#8220;effective dose&#8221; and &#8220;lethal dose&#8221; among other terms. The ED50 is the effective dose that works for 50 percent of the subjects (usually rats). The LD50 is the lethal dose for 50 percent of the subjects. The safety of a drug is measured by a ratio (something like LD50/ED50 or LD1/ED99 something like that I don&#8217;t have the time to look it up). Note that most alternative medicines don&#8217;t have an &#8220;effective dose&#8221; because they don&#8217;t have a measurable endpoint! However, all alternative medicines have a lethal dose, no bones about it. Do you understand why your quote above makes absolutely no sense? To suggest that conventional medicines have a lower safety margin than alternative medicines is absurd. You&#8217;re comparing drugs that work, to drugs that don&#8217;t. Not even apples and oranges. </p>
<p>WRONG: &#8220;As for the prescription drugs: The big problem is that they are only prescribed to treat your &#8216;symptoms&#8217;. &#8216;Oh, your feeling sad &#8211; you must have a prozac deficiency. Take this for the next 30 years&#8217; &#8212; Great system we have here.&#8221;</p>
<p>You&#8217;ve gone off the deep end here. I&#8217;m honestly contemplating if you&#8217;re a Poe.</p>
<p>WRONG: &#8220;People need to find the root cause of their illness and treat it naturally.<br />
If you are completely happy with modern medicine &#8212; good for you.<br />
I was not happy with it, and have chosen to use a safer, natural approach.&#8221;</p>
<p>What do you even mean by &#8220;root cause of their illness&#8221;? Do you mean spirits? Do you mean molecules? What on earth are you talking about? And what is your obsession with the word &#8220;natural&#8221;? You, sir, have fallen for the naturalist fallacy! For some reason, you and many other people think that because something is natural, it&#8217;s good, and that if something is synthetic, it&#8217;s bad. Many of the drugs we use today are natural (we just don&#8217;t call them alternative or &#8220;natural&#8221; medicine because it&#8217;s pointless). Botulism toxin is natural. So are bacteria. Leukemia is natural. The statins are NOT NATURAL. Many antibiotics are synthetically altered. The computer you&#8217;re reading this on is NOT NATURAL. Again, you&#8217;ve fallen for the naturalist fallacy. Classic. Your brain needs rewiring bro.</p>
<p>Hey you get one right!<br />
CORRECT: &#8220;As for evidence? Search PubMed &#8211; you can find a lot of good studies on natural products. Are there as many studies as there are on drugs? No &#8211; because you can&#8217;t patent a natural product and make a gigantic profit (which pays for the studies).&#8221;</p>
<p>Yep, that is an unfortunate part of our system today. Many drugs don&#8217;t get studied due to lack of funding, probably because a lack of profitability. That being said&#8230; and I&#8217;ve repeated this several times now. IF AN &#8220;ALTERNATIVE&#8221; or &#8220;NATURAL&#8221; drug has been shown to work on PubMed&#8230; it is no longer considered an alternative medicine, or a &#8220;natural&#8221; medicine&#8230; from then on, it is just medicine. Doctors use drugs that have been shown to work. We don&#8217;t care whether it&#8217;s natural, herbal, synthetic, alien, whatever you want to call it. We use drugs that are safe enough to where the benefits outweigh the risks. Note that if a drug has no benefits (ie alternative meds), the benefits will never outweigh the risks. </p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Stephanie Z		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539030</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Stephanie Z]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 10:16:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539030</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Anthony, nutriceuticals are a multi-billion dollar business. Such big business, in fact, that Ben&#039;s coworkers decided to invade the comments of my blog this morning. If you&#039;re one of them, you might want to know that Greg is capable of documenting astroturfing just as well as I am.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anthony, nutriceuticals are a multi-billion dollar business. Such big business, in fact, that Ben&#8217;s coworkers decided to invade the comments of my blog this morning. If you&#8217;re one of them, you might want to know that Greg is capable of documenting astroturfing just as well as I am.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Anthony		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539029</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Anthony]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 10:06:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539029</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Barry - 

You are right that natural products have side effects and can be toxic at a certain level. The thing is, usually that level is ridiculously high compared to the average prescription drug.

As for the prescription drugs: The big problem is that they are only prescribed to treat your &#039;symptoms&#039;.  &#039;Oh, your feeling sad - you must have a prozac deficiency. Take this for the next 30 years&#039; -- Great system we have here.

People need to find the root cause of their illness and treat it naturally.

If you are completely happy with modern medicine -- good for you.
I was not happy with  it, and have chosen to use a safer, natural approach.

As for evidence?  Search PubMed - you can find a lot of good studies on natural products. Are there as many studies as there are on drugs? No - because you can&#039;t patent a natural product and make a gigantic profit (which pays for the studies).]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Barry &#8211; </p>
<p>You are right that natural products have side effects and can be toxic at a certain level. The thing is, usually that level is ridiculously high compared to the average prescription drug.</p>
<p>As for the prescription drugs: The big problem is that they are only prescribed to treat your &#8216;symptoms&#8217;.  &#8216;Oh, your feeling sad &#8211; you must have a prozac deficiency. Take this for the next 30 years&#8217; &#8212; Great system we have here.</p>
<p>People need to find the root cause of their illness and treat it naturally.</p>
<p>If you are completely happy with modern medicine &#8212; good for you.<br />
I was not happy with  it, and have chosen to use a safer, natural approach.</p>
<p>As for evidence?  Search PubMed &#8211; you can find a lot of good studies on natural products. Are there as many studies as there are on drugs? No &#8211; because you can&#8217;t patent a natural product and make a gigantic profit (which pays for the studies).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Barry		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539028</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Barry]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 21:22:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539028</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Anthony, you called me an internet tough guy!!... but... you didn&#039;t address anything else. Let&#039;s just take it from the top.

&quot;There are many Alternative approaches to health that can do incredible things.&quot;
First off, why are you capitalizing Alternative? Is that supposed to portray a false sense of authority? Like christians capitalizing &quot;Him&quot;?
Secondly, no they can&#039;t (which is probably why you didn&#039;t cite any examples). Again, if they did amazing things, they would no longer be called &quot;alternative&quot;, they would just be called pharmaceuticals.

Just like Ben... you proceed to demonstrate an unchained ignorance toward the concept of pharmacology. It is in the first chapter of any pharmacology book. All drugs have effects. Period. SOME of these substances have beneficial effects, but EVERY substance known to man can be toxic at the right dosage. Think about it. Now read your quote.

&quot;Have fun taking prescription drugs for your symptoms and then dealing with their side effects. Conventional &#039;Medicine&#039; as you call it, is really great today, isn&#039;t it.&quot;

You actually get the first part right!! Every drug on the market today has side effects! Great job for revealing the truth! But then it falls apart... Did you really just try to suggest that alternative medicines are better than Big Pharma Drugs because they don&#039;t have ANY side effects? Every drug has side effects, regardless of its classification as conventional or alternative. The difference between the two groups is that conventional medicine has been shown to WORK. Alternative medicines are only &quot;believed&quot; to work. Doctors who care about their patients, friends, and family are patiently awaiting the results of any studies that validate your claims. NOBODY wants to see a drug fail. It would be AWESOME if every herb and mineral were shown to have beneficial effects with no side-effects! Unfortunately, the exact opposite has been shown time and time again. The vast majority of alternative drugs, those of which have been tested, have been shown to have no more effect than placebo, in addition to the side effects they cause. Perhaps go to the library and find a pharmacology textbook. Take a look at the &quot;Alternative Medicine&quot; chapter (most modern textbooks include one). 

I could be wrong though. Perhaps it&#039;s a giant world-wide conspiracy between millions of scientists and doctors?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anthony, you called me an internet tough guy!!&#8230; but&#8230; you didn&#8217;t address anything else. Let&#8217;s just take it from the top.</p>
<p>&#8220;There are many Alternative approaches to health that can do incredible things.&#8221;<br />
First off, why are you capitalizing Alternative? Is that supposed to portray a false sense of authority? Like christians capitalizing &#8220;Him&#8221;?<br />
Secondly, no they can&#8217;t (which is probably why you didn&#8217;t cite any examples). Again, if they did amazing things, they would no longer be called &#8220;alternative&#8221;, they would just be called pharmaceuticals.</p>
<p>Just like Ben&#8230; you proceed to demonstrate an unchained ignorance toward the concept of pharmacology. It is in the first chapter of any pharmacology book. All drugs have effects. Period. SOME of these substances have beneficial effects, but EVERY substance known to man can be toxic at the right dosage. Think about it. Now read your quote.</p>
<p>&#8220;Have fun taking prescription drugs for your symptoms and then dealing with their side effects. Conventional &#8216;Medicine&#8217; as you call it, is really great today, isn&#8217;t it.&#8221;</p>
<p>You actually get the first part right!! Every drug on the market today has side effects! Great job for revealing the truth! But then it falls apart&#8230; Did you really just try to suggest that alternative medicines are better than Big Pharma Drugs because they don&#8217;t have ANY side effects? Every drug has side effects, regardless of its classification as conventional or alternative. The difference between the two groups is that conventional medicine has been shown to WORK. Alternative medicines are only &#8220;believed&#8221; to work. Doctors who care about their patients, friends, and family are patiently awaiting the results of any studies that validate your claims. NOBODY wants to see a drug fail. It would be AWESOME if every herb and mineral were shown to have beneficial effects with no side-effects! Unfortunately, the exact opposite has been shown time and time again. The vast majority of alternative drugs, those of which have been tested, have been shown to have no more effect than placebo, in addition to the side effects they cause. Perhaps go to the library and find a pharmacology textbook. Take a look at the &#8220;Alternative Medicine&#8221; chapter (most modern textbooks include one). </p>
<p>I could be wrong though. Perhaps it&#8217;s a giant world-wide conspiracy between millions of scientists and doctors?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Stephanie Z		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539027</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Stephanie Z]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 19:02:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539027</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;a href=&quot;http://almostdiamonds.blogspot.com/2009/07/who-has-profit-motive_01.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;My answer&lt;/a&gt; got long, Ben. ]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://almostdiamonds.blogspot.com/2009/07/who-has-profit-motive_01.html" rel="nofollow">My answer</a> got long, Ben. </p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: xavier		</title>
		<link>https://gregladen.com/blog/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539026</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[xavier]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 15:43:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2009/06/30/fda-limits-on-acetaminophen/#comment-539026</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[One person&#039;s side effects are another person&#039;s effects.  As in estate.  

Michale Jackson for instance. ]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One person&#8217;s side effects are another person&#8217;s effects.  As in estate.  </p>
<p>Michale Jackson for instance. </p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
	</channel>
</rss>
